Introducing the NEW Hobie Mirage Compass

[Mark]

I think it has possibilities to find a niche market.

But I'm disappointed that it's still heavier than my 2012 Revo. I think they should have come in under 60 pounds and they possibly could have done that by making the boat sleeker.

Clearly they are trying to curry favor with kayak anglers who are concerned about stability and who want to stand while they fish.

I want stability of course but I have never felt a need to stand in my kayak to catch fish.

[baitball]

I'm not a school-trained marketing professional, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night...

So take my comment with a grain of salt, but what I see on the Hobie website is a bunch of young, mostly female, water sport enthusiasts enjoying pedaling their new Compass kayak.

The subliminal messaging here is Hobie is targeting the female/wife/girlfriend/daughter/young teenage son market with the hope that a lighter -- as compared to the Outback and PA-series -- boat will encourage this diaspora to join the more hard-core fishing crowd on the water (i.e. "The family that kayaks together, stays together.").

[RavensDfense]

Baitball- I think you're definitely on to something. The lighter weight of the compass will certainly appeal to women anglers/kayakers, as well as to people wanting to add a second kayak for a child.

But I think another reason they came out with the compass has to do with price. Hobie realized it was pricing themselves out of most people's price range. Brands such as Native and Percention (i.e.- Wilderness Systems) have <$2000 pedal kayaks. IMO, Hobie developed the compass to compete within that market. $400-$500 cheaper may not seem like a lot, but for someone who only has $2500 total to spend, they can now get a Hobie and some accessories such as a high end fish finder for the price it would cost to simply purchase a Outback.

I think the decreased weight was secondary benefit due to doing away with the front hatch and other features such as the twist and stow rudder.

I'm considering purchasing one. I consider myself someone who fishes pretty hard, in large water and I see a use for it if it pedals like others have said (cuts through waves like a Revo, with the stability of an Outback).

[baitball]

Baitball- I think you're definitely on to something. The lighter weight of the compass will certainly appeal to women anglers/kayakers, as well as to people wanting to add a second kayak for a child.

But I think another reason they came out with the compass has to do with price. Hobie realized it was pricing themselves out of most people's price range. Brands such as Native and Percention (i.e.- Wilderness Systems) have <$2000 pedal kayaks. IMO, Hobie developed the compass to compete within that market. $400-$500 cheaper may not seem like a lot, but for someone who only has $2500 total to spend, they can now get a Hobie and some accessories such as a high end fish finder for the price it would cost to simply purchase a Outback.

I think the decreased weight was secondary benefit due to doing away with the front hatch and other features such as the twist and stow rudder.

I'm considering purchasing one. I consider myself someone who fishes pretty hard, in large water and I see a use for it if it pedals like others have said (cuts through waves like a Revo, with the stability of an Outback).

I certainly think the maturation of other brands and the exponential growth of kayak technology available on the market today is a wake-up call for Hobie. No longer will they be able to rest on their laurels and expect the market to pay premium price just becausethe name on the side of the hull says, “Hobie”.

Perhaps the Compass is better described as a hybrid boat.

It seems that Hobie combined a few proven features of many of their popular designs into one package. For example, the Compass has the width of an Outback, the bow/entry of a Revolution, the rudder system of a PA, the Lowrance-ready transducer cavity, and the game-changing technology of the Mirage drive into a lighter package.

Hybrid or targeted for the female crowd? Regardless, I think Hobie is trying to regain some lost market share. If you pick one up, I know I for one, will be interested in hearing how she handles fishing duties.

[silasvirus82]

No longer will they be able to rest on their laurels and expect the market to pay premium price just because the name on the side of the hull says, “Hobie”.

I don't understand this common perception of Hobie not being innovative. They just completely reconfigured their main selling point which is the Mirage Drive. Everyone else, albeit a result of their patent, uses the same drive system except Hobie. Hobie hulls are no less durable than any other competitor, and probably at the top of the spectrum from my observations. They're constantly adding to and improving their lineup of accessories which are unmatched by any other brand. Sailing kits, livewells, cooler bags, a Torqueedo specific to the Mirage Drive, on and on... The boats themselves perform as well as, or better than any other option, that's why people want them. A kayak is a kayak, there is only so much you can improve upon. The fact is, Hobie just perfected it faster than anyone else and hasn't had to change as much to stay current. The only thing in my mind that anyone can improve upon at this point is weight. Current tech and economics limit the best kayaks to rotomolding, so unless you want a less durable kayak the weight is what it is. The next big step I see is some sort of composite hull that is cheap and easy to manufacture. Native took a big swing at this with their LT series of yaks which I think is great.

[baitball]

I don't understand this common perception of Hobie not being innovative. They just completely reconfigured their main selling point which is the Mirage Drive. Everyone else, albeit a result of their patent, uses the same drive system except Hobie. Hobie hulls are no less durable than any other competitor, and probably at the top of the spectrum from my observations. They're constantly adding to and improving their lineup of accessories which are unmatched by any other brand. Sailing kits, livewells, cooler bags, a Torqueedo specific to the Mirage Drive, on and on... The boats themselves perform as well as, or better than any other option, that's why people want them. A kayak is a kayak, there is only so much you can improve upon. The fact is, Hobie just perfected it faster than anyone else and hasn't had to change as much to stay current. The only thing in my mind that anyone can improve upon at this point is weight. Current tech and economics limit the best kayaks to rotomolding, so unless you want a less durable kayak the weight is what it is. The next big step I see is some sort of composite hull that is cheap and easy to manufacture. Native took a big swing at this with their LT series of yaks which I think is great.

John,

I agree, Hobie is a premium company and their products are top-of-the-line, well-engineered, and proven, but remember the old paradigm: "There is no truth, there is only perception."

So if other companies can claim to give you the consumer the same (or better) than the premium brand for less money, you'd be foolish to not take it.

I hope with the Compass, Hobie stayed true to its high-quality pedigree, but found a way to shave some production costs and in so doing priced themselves back into the market RavensDfense spoke of.

[silasvirus82]

So if other companies can claim to give you the consumer the same (or better) than the premium brand for less money, you'd be foolish to not take it.

I agree with everything about this statement. The problem for companies competing with Hobie is until their patent runs out they own that drive system. Speaking of innovation, why has no other company done anything besides the propeller system? Concerning pricing, I don't think Hobie is out-of-line, and their recent and maybe future increases seem to be keeping up with inflation. I believe there are two types of shoppers. Budget buyers that can afford a used premium boat or a new paddle driven kayak, and non-budget buyers that can pretty much get anything they want. The difference of a few hundred dollars is inconsequential to Hobie because they have the unique drive system, huge accessory options, and like you mention an extensive positive track record. For some, the whole point of kayaking is that it's relatively cheap. The variance between the best and entry level is maybe $1500, that's nothing when compared to motorboats, cars, houses, etc.

[baitball]

I agree with everything about this statement. The problem for companies competing with Hobie is until their patent runs out they own that drive system. Speaking of innovation, why has no other company done anything besides the propeller system? Concerning pricing, I don't think Hobie is out-of-line, and their recent and maybe future increases seem to be keeping up with inflation. I believe there are two types of shoppers. Budget buyers that can afford a used premium boat or a new paddle driven kayak, and non-budget buyers that can pretty much get anything they want. The difference of a few hundred dollars is inconsequential to Hobie because they have the unique drive system, huge accessory options, and like you mention an extensive positive track record. For some, the whole point of kayaking is that it's relatively cheap. The variance between the best and entry level is maybe $1500, that's nothing when compared to motorboats, cars, houses, etc.

I guess only time, and the market, will tell if this design is a winner.

Heck, in a year you and I may be typing away on this forum singing the praises of the design 'cause we went out and purchased one!

[Mark]

...The problem for companies competing with Hobie is until their patent runs out they own that drive system...

I suspect Hobie is pretty good at protecting its Mirage Drive patents. I've web-searched it and discussions on chat forums from here to Australia raise the patent issue and speculate on free market intervention when Hobie's patent expires. Some of these discussions are 12 years old. What I cannot find is definitive information on Hobie's actual patent(s). Normally a patent lasts for 17 years but perhaps every time Hobie tweaks the Mirage Drive with improvements they can extend the patent. Are there any patent attorneys on Snaggedline who can illuminate us?

I do not expect a less expensive alternative to Hobie's fin drive system anytime soon. The good news is that the Mirage Drive is indeed a proven, effective technology that is long-lasting for those willing to pay the price.

[silasvirus82]

I don't know if it would be possible, but one idea that comes to mind as an alternate to the mirage drive and propeller would be a jet ski type propulsion system with an impeller. Theoretically that would be an almost zero draft system and would not require a rudder, but I'm sure the complexities of it would be too expensive.

EDIT: Ha I actually found someone that tried. https://www.csuchico.edu/mmem/capsto...ive_system.pdf

[baitball]

Introducing the NEW Hobie Mirage Compass

I also think it was smart to get rid of that front hatch. I suspect others may disagree, but some PA owners had complained about water getting into the hull through that hatch.

Especially concerning are the reports of turtled PAs that upon righting had too much water in the hull causing their seaworthiness to be put in question.

A new hatch design or better yet, no hatch, certainly addresses that problem.


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[RavensDfense]

I also think it was smart to get rid of that front hatch. I suspect others may disagree, but some PA owners had complained about water getting into the hull through that hatch.

Especially concerning are the reports of turtled PAs that upon righting had too much water in the hull causing their seaworthiness to be put in question.

A new hatch design or better yet, no hatch, certainly addresses that problem.


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Word on the street is they have attempted to solve this problem on the new PA models. The hatch gasket has been "beefed" up by the looks of it. They did this with the hatch on the 2017 Outback. The difference between my demo 17 and my personal 2015 is quite a bit. The 2017 is much much drier.

Here is a pic of the new hatch on the 2018 PA's...

New Hobie Hatch.jpg

[RavensDfense]

I don't know if it would be possible, but one idea that comes to mind as an alternate to the mirage drive and propeller would be a jet ski type propulsion system with an impeller. Theoretically that would be an almost zero draft system and would not require a rudder, but I'm sure the complexities of it would be too expensive.

EDIT: Ha I actually found someone that tried. https://www.csuchico.edu/mmem/capsto...ive_system.pdf

Looks like a lot of time and energy went into that project.

[Jimbo]

Man! I just bought a new Outback 3 weeks ago. I definitely would have bought this instead. Here's why - It has the width (actually wider) than the outback, I assume its equally as stable, and it has the bow shape of the revolution. So it will cut through the waves like a revo, instead of getting wave slap (and wet) like the outback. I like the rudder - I'm always catching something on my stow-and-go rudder. As far as the missing front hatch - if I really missed it, I'd install a round one.

It seems like a combination of the best parts of the revo and outback with a better rudder. There's a good chance I'll get one anyway.

[baitball]

RavensDfense,

The more I look at the design, the more I think you're right -- the Compass looks to have some very fishable qualities.

Although I will say I am disappointed Hobie didn't take an opportunity and outfit her with a rectangular tackle tray deck hatch and instead chose the round deck hatch. If I were to pick one up, a swap out to the rectangular tackle tray deck hatch would be high on the priority list.