First time trying braid - seeking suggestions/advice

[UnkleRob2020]

I was gifted a Shimano Stradic by a dear friend. Today, I noticed that it is already spooled with braid. I have never utilized braid before. Last year I tried putting Suffix braid on one of my reels and I didn't like the way it felt, so when I went to remove the line from the spool I realized that it was "stuck together" and I had a very difficult time removing it...I don't understand this ... I had put the braid on the best way I know how (I do keep constant tension when putting line on my reel - up until now this has always been mono) and within minutes it had stuck together like when I store a zman and a 12 fathom paddletail together (I only did that once).

Finally, I got frustrated and cut the braid off of the spool...I was shocked by how hard it was to cut through the braid compared to my normal mono. This caused me to "dig in" to my resistance to braid.

Since I already have a reel with braid on it (Thank you, John V), I'd like to try it out. When utilizing braid, most people use a flouro leader, correct? I have some 30lb flouro that I bought to go with the braid. Is 30lb flouro too big to utilize as a leader for the braid for the type of tidal fishing that we generally do in this area?

I am going to watch some videos of how to attach a flouro leader to braid....I will be grateful for any suggestions as well...

Tight lines everyone

[nhunter344]

For lighter line braid to fluoro (<10lb) connections, I just use a uni to uni connection. For anything bigger, I use an FG knot. I prefer the teeth method, but here is a video of another way to tie it.

EASIEST Way to Tie the FG Knot (Strongest Braid to Leader Fishing Knot) - YouTube

Edit to add that 30lb is fine. Ive never found fish in our area to be leader shy.

[Jim McFalls]

Congrats on the Stradic! I made the switch to these great reels a few years ago on my topwater and jig casting setups. They are great. As far as braid vs mono is concerned, I swear by PowerPro braid for every application - topwater casting, jig casting and vertical/snap jigging - except trolling, where I use mono. My topwater setup includes 20lb PowerPro braid on a Stradic 3000, with a 30lb mono leader. I use this almost exclusively for stripers, speckled trout and redfish (in NC). No need for the more expensive flouro in my opinion. The jig casting setup is 10lb double strand PowerPro braid on a Stradic 2500, with a 20lb mono leader. The vertical/snap jigging setup includes 20lb PowerPro on a Shimano Curado baitcaster, with 30lb mono leader. I also got into the habit of changing the leader after every outing where I catch a lot of fish, and I have been fortunate this spring in that regard. Catching quality fish that is, and one of the best springs in my 10 year kayak fishing experience! I prefer braid for the casting benefit, since that's mostly how I fish. I can cast braid twice as far as mono (when needed), and since it's not nylon, there is no "reel memory" which significantly reduces backlash and bird nest potential. It takes getting used to, that's for sure. And make sure you use a long and strong enough piece of leader (3'?) so that a spinning striper's spiny dorsal fin can't break it. That mishap would surely snap the braid. I learned that the hard way, and you can thank Shawn Kimbro for that last bit of intel. I sure have! I don't use tackle either - I use a double uni knot to tie the leader directly to the braid. I use a mono backing on the reels and periodically throughout the year (since I fish the salt year-round) replace some or all of the braid. I replace all the braid on my 2 casting rigs since I use them the most.

I hope this helped. And for a laugh and some gear tips, check out my YT channel - Jimbo the Fishin' Musician!

Tight lines!

[bignose]

Braid can bury itself into the spool when the top layer is tighter than the under layers. It is so thin that the top layer "cuts" into the under wraps. The nice thing about a Stradic reel is that it has a nice, tight, winding pattern.

Also, immediately after casting, make sure that the bail isn't trapping a loose loop of line on the spool as you begin to wind. That loose loop will cause a horrendous "line booger" on the next cast as it pulls off the line in a big bundle.

To combat this, you can flip the bail over by hand, or trap the line against the rod with your index finger, after the bail flips over, to create some tension and prevent the loop from forming. If you get a line booger (and you will) these can usually be gently picked out by pulling on the loop, after all it's only a slip knot.

30 pound flouro is overkill unless you are fishing the pilings of the Bay Bridge. Only if you are fishing very rocky areas or around a lot of docks, for the most part you are fishing open water.

I generally use 10-12 pound test mono for my leaders for the 10 pound test braid I use. I'm not a fan of flouro, but that's me.

Knowing who you got the reel from, I figure it may have 15-20 pound test braid ( and braid generally breaks well above it's advertised breaking strength.
(The 10 lb. Sufix braid I use tests out about 18 lb. actual).
So a 12-15 lb. leader is about all you'll need.

I figure that you are going to be fishing your usual paddletails with 1/8 - 1/4 oz. size jigheads on a medium-light rod.

I connect my leaders to braid with two loops, one on the end of my running line and one on the end of my leader. I then use a loop-to-loop connection. I use about 3-4 feet of leader. Generally, this will break at the mono loop knot if you get hung up. It will pass thru the guides with minimal friction.
There are better knots to use, check them out on YouTube.

One thing with braid is not to use the rod held at a 90 degree angle to the line, to pull with if you get snagged. You will break the rod.
I think I broke 2-3 when I first stated using braid. One was on a snag while trolling, the other two were on Cownosed Rays in Baltimore Harbor.

Braid has zero stretch.
If you get snagged, do not pull the line with your hand, it will cut you. Palm the spool to keep it from turning and pull with the rod pointed directly at the snagged lure to break it off. Same thing if you hook a Ray. Point the rod at the fish, lock up the spool with your palm and break off by pulling straight.

There is a learning curve to fishing braid, but once you get used to it, you won't want to go back to mono.

[dsaavedra]

Great advice so far. I have been using braid on all of my reels for over 15 years. I would never go back to mono, I much prefer the way braid handles.

There are many knots you can use for tying braid to a leader. The best knot is the one you can tie quickly and confidently. An FG knot that takes you 45 minutes and 3 attempts to tie that unravels after 5 casts anyway because you still weren't able to tie it right in a bouncing kayak with 15mph wind will do you no good whatsoever. Don't get me wrong, the FG knot is a fine knot, it has it's time and place. It's a stellar choice for super thick, heavy leader material where a different knot would get too bulky. But for the types of inshore tidal fishing we commonly do with relatively light braid/leader, it is unnecessarily complex and overkill IMO. I have tried many different line-to-leader knots and I always keep going back to the double-uni. It's strong, I can tie it quickly and reliably, and I have confidence in it. Those are the most important aspects of any knot. The Albright knot, Alberto knot, and modified/improved versions of each are also popular line-to-leader knot choices.

It's worth noting that certain line-to-lure knots can slip when using braid because it is so thin and slick. I don't have a comprehensive list of which knots are and are not compatible with braid, but I know from firsthand experience that a basic clinch knot can slip, while uni knot and palomar knot are two knots that will not slip when tied properly.

I like to keep things simple. I use a uni knot to tie on lures and a double-uni knot to tie on leaders.

You noted difficulty in cutting braid. It can be tricky. A sharp pair of scissors, sharp knife, or quality side cutters have worked well for me. Nail clippers have never worked well for me, and dull scissors/knife don't work well either.

[rugbyfish]

I will admit that I really only use leaders when targeting toothy fish specifically, and for those situations I use a double uni knot. For most of my kayak fishing outings, I either use tactical angler clips tied directly to braid or tie lures directly to the braid itself. I’ve fished side by side with folks that use leaders many times and haven’t noticed a discernible difference in catch rates for fish like stripers and specks. I do check the braid immediately
above the knot for abrasion often and re-tie when necessary. 15 and 20lb Sufix 832 braid has served me well, but I’ve had good experiences with PowerPro too. Bottom line, do whatever you’re most comfortable with or whatever gives you the most fishing time.

[J.A. Veil]

Rob - The reel I gave you is filled with 10-lb Powerpro all the way to the spool (no mono backing). I use 10-lb Powerpro on all but one of my rods (the heaviest one gets 20-lb braid). I recommend that you use 20-lb mono or fluoro for your leader. If you already have a spool of 20-lb braid on hand, use that first. If you fish in very clear waters (like the Florida Keys where I fished today), I prefer a fluoro leader. When I think I may encounter heavy fish, I take the extra time to tie a double uni knot to connect the braid to the leader. But most of the time when I am anticipating fish under 30", I use a quick and easy version of the surgeon's knot that I can tie easily on the kayak even with my fishing gloves on. Here is an image from one of my presentations that shows the knot. Lay the braid and the leader side by side. Hold both strands and tie a simple overhand knot. Then pass the strands through the loop two more times. Pull tight and trim the tag ends. I use the tiny scissors on a small Swiss army knife to cut braid and mono. I carry the knife in a pocket of my PFD.

simple knot.jpg

Jim McFalls talks about using a long leader, as he learned from Shawn Kimbro. The only downside I know of from a long leader is that the knot is likely to catch in the rod tip on a cast, and I don't like that. To avoid that issue, I usually add an ~18" leader. After retying several times, the leader gets shorter. I keep using the same leader until it gets to about 6", then tie on a new one. I don't think I have ever lost a fish because the leader broke off on a striper fin.

As you can see from the other commenters there are many ways to fish and to set up your gear. There is not just one right way. Figure out a system that works for you and practice it until it feels comfortable.

Finally, when grabbing the line to lift a fish into your kayak or to pull it loose from a snag, be cautious about pulling on the braid portion of the line. Taut braid is very sharp and can easily cut your hand, particularly when the skin is wet. Try to grab the leader instead (this is my main reason for using a leader).

[Jim McFalls]

John!

The knot you describe above is what I use if I need to tie while on the kayak, and it is strong enough to tow a Hundai! OK, maybe not a Hundai, but it is super strong!

[Mark]

Rob,

I recall very well my conversion to braided line. I was amazed at the sensitivy of the line; how I could feel every tap and and bump of a fish on my lure.

I use mono leaders. Specifically, I use Berkley Triline Big Game. (I also construct tapered leaders for fly fishing from the same Big Game spools.) Mono is much cheaper than fluoro and in some ways tougher. It's less likely to snap when abraided by riprap or barnacles on pilings. Also, mono has a little stretch which can be helpful in certain situations like topwater bites. Further, none of our tidal species are leader shy. If you think about it, most of our strikes come from behind the lure. The fish doesn't see the leader and I believe if it did, it would not care and certainly would not understand the significance of it. That's proven by folks who forego leaders altogether yet still catch plenty of fish. However, I like a mono leader to avoid being cut by taught braid when handling a fish boatside.

As others have mentioned, 30-pound test is overkill. Ten to 20-pound test is more than sufficient. I use 30-pound test only when pickerel fishing to reduce bite-offs. It's not the hammerhandle picks that you have to worry about. It's the 22 to 24-inchers with their large gaping toothy mouth that may shred a leader lighter than 30 pounds.

I use a double uni knot to connect the leader to my braid because it makes a relatively small knot that will slip through the rod tip guide. But if time is a factor on the water, I will use a double surgeon's knot for the connection. I will change it to a double uni when I get home.

My leaders are 2 to 3 feet.

[UnkleRob2020]

Oh my goodness...this is so much useful information...thank you everyone...I intend to test the braid this weekend...it will be the first time ever that I will have casted with braid (with the exception of charter trips)...thank you so much

Tight lines everyone

[UnkleRob2020]

Thank you everyone for all of your help and suggestions. I fished on Monday with two rods...an ultralight with mono and a light rod with braid. The leader knots that I had tied slipped on two separate occasions and I lost the both lures...which I haven't sacrifced too much of my tackle to the Fishing Gods lately, so I didn't mind too much. Arron pulled up next to me and helped me.

I tend to pick some things up slowly, such as watching someone else tie a knot and then being able to replicate it later by myself. I am not going to give up on braid...at least not now...I am going to practice tying the knots...everyone that I look up to on this forum fishes with braid (I think) and I just have to accept the learning curve.

I appreciate all of you for all of your help.