Tis the Season for Catchin' Cows

[tufnik]

How do kayak fisherman catch cows (big rocks)?

I caught a 42" rock last year (Nov), but that was off a headboat out from Solomons. It took us about half an hour to get to the trolling area (50-100 ft depth) and I estimate it was far southeast of Lookout Point. We used teasers/lures on their heavy duty reels with heavy heavy line. You don't fight the fish, you just crank like heck. For real fun, I'd like to catch a cow like that off my kayak and own gear.

Can we catch them near shore, or do we need to go deep out where the boats go? (maybe 5-15 miles out)

Where are the places for the best chance? I know Kayak Kevin can catch cows, and he does it off the wrecks in Kiptopeke where the launch point is hours away. Is there somewhere within 1-2 hours from D.C. (e.g., Lookout Point up to north of Baltimore).

Are the parachutes the best way? Or just use bucktails and deep dive crankbaits? Do I need to use sleds? (off a kayak?!?!?)

Is trolling the best way? Jigging in deep water?

Don't get me wrong. I like all sorts of fishing, but Nov/Dec is the season for big rocks. So I'd like to focus on that using my electric-powered kayak.

[DOGFISH]

In this area, April and May are the best months. Your best chance is to fish near the shipping channel. When you fish out of SPSP you are in the right area for springtime large fish. Off of Hacketts bar is a good area, out near the channel. Some of the kayakers launch at Hemmingways, that would put you near the channel. Matapeake State park is near the channel, but I hear they charge for parking now. Mayo Beach Park, AA County web site, gives access to the open bay, for a yearly launch pass. If you can launch over rip-rap, Thomas Point County park is close to open water. However, Thomas Point is not an easy launch.

There are areas. The spring tropy season is mostly for migratory fish. The big females come up to the rivers to spawn. They move up and down the main channels. In the spring, you must fish the main bay to keep any fish. The smaller tributaries are closed to keeping fish. If you troll the deeper water at anytime of the year, you can catch fish in excess of 30 inches. However, the spring is the season for the big ones.

Good Luck.

[Memory Maker]

The fish seem to stay around the deep water all winter. You might try drifting eels on the edges of the channels like they do around Cbbt to Cape Charles ...... but PLO area keeps the cows all winter in the channels

[ictalurus]

I was thinking about trolling the area around Piney Point in the Potomac. The local tackleshop has had good reports for winter fishing in that area in years past.

[DOGFISH]

As far as what to use, I like crankbaits. People on the forum are probably tired of hearing me talk of crankbaits. For me they work. For anyone using an electric boat or a Hobie peddle boat, crankbaits can be kept in motion. For the largers spring rockfish, I use the Rapala 15s, 20s and 30s magnum series X-Raps. I like the colors Glass Ghost, Red Head and Bunker. After trying to keep these at a reasonable trolling speed, you will understand why I use an electric motor. Stretch lures made Mann's Bait Company also work well. In the fall, I use smaller crankbaits in the rivers. Big fish want big baits. Parachutes and large bucktails do work well. Just add a large rubber swimm shad to the hook.

I like the crankbaits, as there are no weights in between the rod and the lure. I am not one who likes to fight a fish and a large weight. I do use the weighted rigs from time to time, but the crankbaits are my favorite. They just work.

By the way, what type of electric kayak are you using, or how did set up your electric motor.

[tufnik]

ictal, please let us know how PP turns out.

Dogfish, you sure are source of good info. Being new to the forum, I appreciate everyone's help. I'm going to try many of your suggestions.

I don't know where all these places (Hacketts Bar, etc.) are, so I'm going to have to get me a local map from somewhere in Annapolis. Anglers?

I've been kayak fishing for about year and a half. I have an OK Prowler Trident 13 Angler. I rigged a Minn Kota Endura 30 with a 85 AH marine battery. All installed for less than $200. Installation required no holes drilled. People have asked me about it, so I think I'm going to provide details in the Dry Dock forum of this web site.

[DOGFISH]

I did something similar with my 15' Trident, which I recently sold. I used a milk crate and an Old Town canoe motor mount with an Endura. I then used an Island Hopper mount with the same Endura on my Big Game Prowler. I liked the electric motor for trolling so much I purchased a BassYak set up this year. I do alot of trolling, so I modified the kayak. The electric motor makes a nice trolling rig.

You don't need to buy alot a charts. You can go to the NOAA web site and view most charts for free. Below is the address for the chart you will need for the bridge area and south. Hacketts point is just south of the Bay Bridge on the western shore. The better fishing is generally out in the 30' depth, give or take, depending on the fish. Hemmingways is south of the bridge on the eastern side of the Bay. If you need a hard copy, West Marine sells the NOAA charts. I do so much fishing in the area, I have chart 12270 framed and hanging on my family room wall.

http://www.charts.noaa.gov/OnLineViewer/12270.shtml

The maps are alittle tricky to use until you get the hang of centering the area you want to look at, then zoom in. I have posted a photo of my present kayak below:




Good Luck finding your way around the area.

[Memory Maker]

ictal, please let us know how PP turns out.

Dogfish, you sure are source of good info. Being new to the forum, I appreciate everyone's help. I'm going to try many of your suggestions.

I don't know where all these places (Hacketts Bar, etc.) are, so I'm going to have to get me a local map from somewhere in Annapolis. Anglers?

I've been kayak fishing for about year and a half. I have an OK Prowler Trident 13 Angler. I rigged a Minn Kota Endura 30 with a 85 AH marine battery. All installed for less than $200. Installation required no holes drilled. People have asked me about it, so I think I'm going to provide details in the Dry Dock forum of this web site.

Please provide the details ........ I'm very interested in mounting an electric engine on my PA for next year.

[DOGFISH]

Memory Maker: You may already know. Torqueedo makes a motor that fits the PA. It is on the Hobie web site, under options. It also fits some of the other Hobies. It drops into the place where the peddle drive drive goes. The Torqueedo motor is alittle expensive, but it is also more powerful than most trolling motors. I think it is around 1hp. The good thing about the Torqueedo is that the battery only weights 6lbs. The bad news is an additional batter costs $599. If you mount the Torqueedo in the hole for the peddle drive, you still steer with the rudder. If you mount it in place of the rudder you steer with your steering lever, and the motor can be folded up onto the boat.

I think bassyak actually makes a mount for the PA. My first motor mount was made of a milk crate, with a piece of starboard mounted to the top. I drilled the starboard to mount an Old Town Canoe motor mount. I then mounted the electric motor to the board on the motor mount. The battery sat in the milk crate. It worked well. That sort of thing can be mounted onto any kayak. I am not sure how tufnik mounted his motor. He may have used another method. There are several methods on YouTube for mounting electric motors to a kayak. However, for the PA the Torqueedo is a powerful motor, with a clean installation. You can even carry your peddle drive in the front compartment as your backup. I think the Torqueedo with one battery cost around $1799.00.

I have been thinking of getting a PA. The Torqueedo option is why I like the PA as a platform for trolling. I have a bad back, one operation already, and peddling may not be good for me. I would buy the spare battery for extended range. I now use two deep cycle, 105 AH batteries in my Big Game Prowler. I am quite a load myself, so with me, motor and equipment, I am getting near the 600lb capacity OKBG. Each battery is 69lbs. That is why I like the lithium battery option.

Good luck, hope this helps alittle.

[Memory Maker]

Dogfish ........ thanks for the info ....... yes I've looked at those motor systems and they look great but since I have no experience with a motor on a Kayak, I want to see if I like them before putting alot of money into something I might not like. Also, I'm not sure I would want to replace my flippers with a motor ........ I think I'd like to have both so i could provide an assist and more speed if I needed/wanted it. I'm also not sure I want to replace my rudder with a unit for the times I just want to pedal. I was thinking of a side mount where I could have both the pedal and the rudder and raise it when I get into shallow water etc .......... I've used electric motors on reservoir rigs for years so I have experience on those but I know nothing about the motors on Yaks so I'm looking for as much input/pros and cons as I can get ..........

Also ...... I want to meet you some time ....... I think we have alot in common ....... i.e. both build rods, probably make lures and yak (although I'm a rank beginner)

[DOGFISH]

Memory Maker: There is also a company in Florida that makes a motor bracket that fits into a kayak rod holders for a side mount, Island Hopper: http://www.islandhopperoutboards.com...ayakmount.html

They also make electric motors for PA and other Hobie kayaks. Some of these options may also work for some of the other Hobie and non-Hobie kayakers wanting to try an electric. It does make trolling easier. This is an easy way to mount an electric and remove it without modifying the kayak.

We will meet. I am going to try to make some of the meet and greets. I have been kayak fishing for about four years now and have become totally absorbed by it.

Good Luck.

[Memory Maker]

Memory Maker: There is also a company in Florida that makes a motor bracket that fits into a kayak rod holders for a side mount, Island Hopper: http://www.islandhopperoutboards.com...ayakmount.html

They also make electric motors for PA and other Hobie kayaks. Some of these options may also work for some of the other Hobie and non-Hobie kayakers wanting to try an electric. It does make trolling easier. This is an easy way to mount an electric and remove it without modifying the kayak.

We will meet. I am going to try to make some of the meet and greets. I have been kayak fishing for about four years now and have become totally absorbed by it.

Good Luck.

Yeah ........ been seriously eyeing that one ........... was wondering what kind of speed you get from a 30 lb thrust and the run time .......... used to get about 3-4 hrs on 1 batttery and a 28# thrust on the reservoirs on a boat ......

[DOGFISH]

I used a 30 lb thrust Endura on my Big Game. I would get 4 hours from that on a 90 AH deep bycle battery. That depended alot on wind and waves, around 4 hours is a good number. The PA is a bit wider but should be similar.

Electric motors are not set up for speed. There is not much pitch to the prop. I would get about 3.5 mph with the 30 lb thrust. I now have a 55 lb thrust MinnKota, which is part of the BassYak set up, and I only get a little more speed, 3.8 to 4 mph, given wind a waves. Those are good numbers for you to estimate. I read along discussion once on another forum about electric motors and prop pitch. One of the guys must have been an engineer. He was really into it. Due to the pitch, or lack of, you will not get much more speed even if you go to a larger motor. Electric motors are mostly for moving a larger boat, such as a bass boat, short distances in quiet fashion. The gas engine is for speed. For kayaks most agree that the 30 lb thrust motors are better and more efficient due to drawing less power. I went to the 55 lb thrust because of wind and waves. The 55 does seem to recover faster after a series of waves passes the kayak.

The 55 does use noticably more power. I went to a 105 AH battery and would get 4 hours of strong use, 5 hours overall. It would be weak towards the end of 5 hours. I now have two batteries with a selector switch and am good for a strong 8 hours. If you are going to use only one battery, use a 105 AH battery, even with a 30. Remember, when trolling you are running continiously, not stop and go as in bass fishing. You need to move about 3 mph for good trolling speed. With two batteries the kayak is heavy. You may have seen the photo of the wave comming over my bow, in one of the photos I posted following one of my fishing trips. It was very rough that day.

All in all, the side mount works very well. What I used to do was lock the electic motor in straight, with the adjustment screw and steer with my rudder. It worked great and you don't have to modify the kayak. Take the mount out of the rod holders and the kayak is back to its original condition.

Good Luck.

[tufnik]

The Enduro 30 is pretty efficient. It has 5 speeds. I use 1 to maintain position while fishing (e.g., jigging, casting, bottom fishing). I use 2 and 3 for trolling. I usually paddle while I troll to get exercise and help the motor/battery. I usually use 4 and 5 just to get from point a to b. Again, I usually paddle along with the motor. Actually, 5 is too much and I rarely use it because I'm not in a real hurry and I prefer conserving the battery energy.

According to the Minn Kota manual, a 90 AH battery lasts about 3 hrs on 5 (full throttle, 30# thrust). I usually kayak fish 4-7 hours on the water with a combination of drifting, trolling, and maintaining position. The most I've used my 85 AH battery on a single outing is down to about 35% charge. That is, I used 65%.

Now, that's for a relatively efficient kayak. My OK Prowler Trident 13 is 29 inches wide. A PA or Big Game is wider (I think 34-35"). So, you can expect more energy usage for a given speed on these wider kayaks.

A PA has 600# capacity, but I don't need that. I'm 155# and with all my gear, total weight is well within my Trident's rated capacity of about 300#. I prefer kayak efficiency over capacity. Also, my Trident weighs less than 60#, which is easy to load on my minivan. A PA, I think, is 80-90#.

Anyway, those are some of the things to think about.

[tufnik]

Don't know why, I have no Edit function on the posting.

Correction:
PA weight is 88#
PA width is 38 inches, not 34-35
Trident max capacity is 450#, not 300
Trident weight is 56#