test ride on Slayer Propel

[JohnE]

I have had my pro angler seat all the way up, going down river on the upper susky, and did a U-turn into the current without feeling like im going to turtle or over tippy. And i have the 12' which is 2" narrower than a 14'. Have you test drove a pro angler before saying its tippy with the seat adjusted?

I did not test one...I watched a video of one of their team members nearly capsizing when they were simply making a hard turn on flat water with the seat in high position. I've also read reports from some PA owners that it is not exactly as stable as they had hoped in rough water and that secondary stability can be a problem.

[J.A. Veil]

Raptor's remarks are well said. The snaggedline.com site has been blessedly free of most of the nasty bickering that tends to plague many other online chat boards. When I started this thread, I did not intend to open the door for people criticizing other brands of kayaks -- rather it was to provide the first hands-on report of a new kayak model that has received some attention among kayak anglers. No kayak is perfect. They all offer advantages and disadvantages. Each of us has his/her own set of criteria for buying and using a particular brand. No brands are inherently bad or good -- it is the features, cost, weight, appearance, comfort, and other factors each of us considers when buying.

I hope we can continue to have constructive dialogues about our personal favorites without resorting to excessive negativity.

[Skidsteer]

I am new to kayak fishing and a new owner of a used propel drive on a Mariner hull. I have been loving the fishing and am thankful for the boat to get out and enjoy the waters near home.

Below are some of my impressions from both research and experience.

Regarding the drive:

- Yes, Native had some issues with cracking and didn't handle it well at first - blaming a finicky design issue on customer abuse. I have read that Native has since taken care of the customers and modified the drive unit. One of mine is cracked and I will say that the fix is so easy and cheap that I would not hesitate to buy another used and cracked unit if the price is right. Of course, I would expect Native to take care of it if I had bought it new.

- Native has changed the prop system for ease of maintenance and easier pedaling. I upgraded mine and the new version is very easy to pedal and troll with. 2.5 to 3 miles per hour is not difficult at all even pulling four paddle tails of various weight behind ( 2 tandem rigs).

- It clogs easily when there is debris in the water (like this time of year), however, it peddles easy enough that you do not need to lock the drive in place or keep the cover on when pedaling at trolling speeds. When it gunks up, I either pedal backwards one revolution, or lift drive to clear it if reverse pedaling does not work.

- As far as I know, the systematic issues with the drive have been corrected in the new models - but it is a piece of mechanical equipment - and used in water - so expect some maintenance to naturally go along with that. (think outboard lower unit, for instance)

Regarding the hull:

- I have a Mariner hull which from a manufacturing standpoint I have had no issues with.

- It is stable and roomy, but I think it has issues with weight balance (nose sits too high) and weight needed to get the propel drive deep into the water. With a lighter paddler , I think the propel drive sits a little too high in the water and can cavitate when pushed hard. My wife and youngest son notice this but my oldest son and I weight the boat down and can pedal hard with no issues.

- I place my gear up front and keep a heavy anchor in the bow storage and that works well for me. I am going to try some laundry bags filled with rocks for ballast for the lighter paddlers - should do the trick but won't be very portable.

- The new slayer looks like a much better platform from a hull design and fishing standpoint. Based on reports, it may not be quite as stable as a Mariner - but I have not ridden one myself.

- Native also has an "Ultimate" model with propel drive in a 14.5' version. It is an open sit-in canoe/kayak hybrid that with airbags, skirting and a bilge pump looks like it would be a great ride. I'm looking for a used one at a bargain price - just because I think it would be cool .

Regarding customer service:

- Native relies on the local dealer as the primary contact for customer service. Choose your dealer wisely and with the added help of local pro staff (if needed) I would expect Native to take care of any issues that would arise.

Hope to see you on the water.

[Memory Maker]

I did not test one...I watched a video of one of their team members nearly capsizing when they were simply making a hard turn on flat water with the seat in high position. I've also read reports from some PA owners that it is not exactly as stable as they had hoped in rough water and that secondary stability can be a problem.

.......... But you did stay in a Holiday Inn Express .......

Just kidding ........... but John ............... too many guys here that have them and love them and will not let you get away with expressing things that are not true ........... I can tell you that it is darn near impossible to turn it over without some big external factor ......... and I'm a really fat old guy ..........

The 1's talking about secondary stability are usually talking about surf launchs ..........

Maybe you should try 1 ....... I have 2 and you can use 1 of mine if you want to try 1

[JohnE]

I would love to try one. I am actually going to try the revo 13 this weekend if the weather does not prevent it.

A revo with a set of outriggers for really rough conditions might be an option for me. I just read a story from one guy online who turtled his PA in rough conditions. His friend was in a Revo with outriggers and did just fine in the same conditions.

Would also love to try the slayer as well.

The Hobie guys just seem to get all uptight when people suggest that they might not be the best thing since sliced bread. I'm seriously considering owning a Hobie and all the comments I've been reading about the various issues are from Hobie owners, not from owners of other brands criticizing them.

I am glad that Native has something competitive to offer, and I appreciate hearing first hand reports of how people like all these different kayaks. Did not mean for it to get so negative.

[Pinch]

The Biggest factor of people falling out of their kayaks is USER ERROR. A close second are inexperienced anglers biting off more than they can chew by attempting to go out in weather they are not prepared for.

I use the Hobie revolution and it is my favorite kayak for the type of fishing I do. I agree that the seat in the Revo is garbage that is why I spent the extra $$ to make it better. I also admit that the parts in the mirage drive are not the most reliable for the amount of wear and tear that I put on them. That being said I love the hobie brand.

No matter what kayak you own when you get careless you will make a mistake and you will end up in the water, I don't care how "stable" it is.

[PigPen]

I have a Native Mariner and have been quite pleased. I like the seating option of the new slalyers and the jacksons and from experience with cavitation on my propel drive it would be nice to squeak out some more speed. To be fair, I can peddle so fast that putting a paddle into go faster doesn't help. It does sound like its heavier than my mariner which is about as much boat as I can carry and lift into the truck. The stability is amazing and I fly fish stnding in rivers and with some waves and wakes. Turning radius I often lean severely to really make tight corners but I don't come close to flipping. I love being able to rig up rods while peddling or trolling. The boats are all around nice boats and so far I haven't been in a type of water that it didn't work. I haven't been out to the deep atlantic yet though.

[DOGFISH]

I have not found the Hobie PA to be anything but stable. The only problem that I have experienced is with a following sea, when the rudder is lifted out of the water by waves approaching from behind, causing a bit of loss of control. However, I probably should not have been out in those windy conditions. I was also going a little faster than I should have been going with the eVolve motor. When pushed by the following waves, in addition to the speed of the motor, the back of the kayak actually comes out of the water. I have found the PA to be very stable. I am a fat old guy myself. I can turn in the seat and get tackle or change out batteries, which are in the rear area of the kayak.

I think the stability issue of the turn, is simply the shift of the PA to one side, given the hull design, with an almost twin hull design, for lack of better explanation. I have not found that it comes any where near turtle. I agree with Pinch, that a lot of this type thing comes down to the individual user, experience and expectations.

As far as secondary stability, that is really not a strong suit for sit-on-top kayaks. That is more of a sit inside kayak or sea kayak design strength. I have never expected much of a secondary stability offering from the SOT.

Again, this is the beauty of the sport. There are so many designs to choose from, for differing folks. Whether it is paddle, peddle, electric motor, there is something for everyone. I must also agree with those who go and try out kayaks before buying one. That is probably the best decision one can make.